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NEWS 581 - 93 Comments
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I'm still worried about the underlying racism out there.... the Bradley Factor, I think it's called.
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There is also increasing evidence of "dirty tricks" - emails, flyers, phone calls giving out misinformation to confuse and prevent people, mostly blacks and minorities, from voting.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/27508967/
Is someone or some party getting a bit desperate?
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Well, I hold my blue inked finger high in pride. It was rather neat to see all of those people standing in line waiting to cast their vote.
I couldn't help but looking at people and trying to figure out who they were going to vote for based just on how they look or were dressed.
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Been in line to vote for about 10 minutes. At least I have wifi...
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Ballot cast. However, there was a casualty: my iPhone got corrupted at some point and I lost all my shit. So now I'm at home trying to restore it.
The things I have to endure in the name of democracy...
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Who knows. Maybe there was some sort of security device that scrambled upon entering the voting booth. :) We were told that we couldn't have cameras or anything, not even on our phones. No pat downs or anything, though.
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Voted. Ang, Anna & I were in and out in 15 min.
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I did my part. Went in around 10:30 and it took no more than 15 minutes. Nothing worth mentioning.
I don't think I've seen anything mentioned on here about the 2 props yet. Are there downsides to either of them that I'm not seeing? I did see a ridiculous commercial against the marijuana one, which showed teens setting up "pot dens" near their schools. I couldn't help laughing at the absurdity of it.
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Ross said:
Ballot cast. However, there was a casualty: my iPhone got corrupted at some point and I lost all my shit. So now I'm at home trying to restore it.
The things I have to endure in the name of democracy...
As a result of voting?
Well the die has been cast. The online bookmakers have Obama at greater than 10 to 1 odds so things are looking good for now.
Election day should be a national holiday in my view. How absurd that it isn't in a place that calls itself the bastion of democracy.
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Well, it was due to me farting around with my phone in line, using the school's wifi. I went to update some apps, and next thing I knew, all my icons were gone. Took me forever to restore everything.
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I just had an interesting exchange with a customer.
Me (making small talk): "So did you do your duty yet?"
Him: "Vote? No. I don't believe in that. They're all a bunch of crooks."
Me (in a friendly joking manner): "You know you don't have the right to complain about things if you don't vote."
Now he's obviously irritated with me and spouts about the First Amendment and Freedom of Speech and how he can complain all he wants.
Yikes. It kinda caught me off guard. I know the rule is never talk politics in business... but *geesh!* I thought just the act of voting itself was a safe topic! He had a little tirade and clearly was sick of explaining himself to everyone. How can you not "believe" in voting when you're clearly not happy with the ways things are?
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Haha, serves you right, you damn activist! :)
It seems to me that the election is already over. Aside from their current projection of 98.9% that Obama wins, if you look at FiveThiryEight.com, they project that McCain has 0 chance of winning the election without winning Ohio. And if you look at just about any poll, they show Obama winning Ohio, thus assuring overall victory. Even 538's odds are 88% that Obama will win Ohio. So I don't want to speak too soon, but it looks like it's already in the bag.
A few of my coworkers are heading down to Grant Park tonight where Obama will be holding his election night rally; I'm kind of jealous. It's great weather out here and it will definitely be a historic event.
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I heard an interesting comment on the radio where a guy said that he didn't vote because if voting made any real difference, the government would prohibit that too. Essentially his argument was that in the 2 party system, the candidates are essentially the same. They may have differing ideas about abortion, gun control, gay marriage, etc., but fundamentally politicians are subject to the imperatives of corporate lobbyists.
While I agree to an extent about the corporate lobbyists, and any lobbyist for that matter, I'm excited about Obama. I get the feeling that he will work out well.
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I heard the idiot Michael Savage last night refer to Obama, comparing his "civilian army" concept and other things to the Nazi's rise to power. What an ass. First of all, they need to make up their minds. Is Obama a Fascist or a Marxist? They're two very different social systems.
I agree with you Bone. I have good feelings about Obama. It's the rest of America (Re: Red States) that I'm worried about.
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McCain and Obama might be too similar for some people's tastes, but one key issue in general sets them apart: Obama would never have gone into Iraq in the first place and spoke out against it as "a dumb war." That's a major difference and I don't think you can argue otherwise.
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If anyone has DirecTV, channel 352 is awesome. It shows ABC, CBS, FOX, NBC, CNN, Fox News, MSNBC, and BBC America simultaneously, and you can select which one's audio you want to hear.
It's too early to know shit, but I'm feeling butterflies in my stomach...
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Well Pennsylvania looks like it's in the bag. Good news. Other key states are close.
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Bunky, I hope you're going to go the non-bigot route and vote against Prop 8 in CA. That might be one of the most interesting things going on this election...
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CNN just called Ohio for Obama... I'm going to pop the cork...
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Don't even get me started on Prop 8. Talk about a waste of tax dollars. It is annoying to me that it is even on the ballot. We voted on gay marriage issues in 2000, 61% of the people in state opposed it, and the California Supreme Court overruled it.
Gay marriage is already legal in the state, so why are we even voting on it?
I hate propositions for reason just like prop 8. While yes, you are voting on gay marriage, there are so many other underlying issues. I have no opinion on gay marriage, it doesn't apply to me and it is not place to judge.
What I have a problem with is requiring churches or anyone to marry an couple, same sex or not, or risk being sued. I don't think forcing anyone to do anything against their personal beliefs is okay.
I know ministers that have refused to marry a "traditional" couple because they didn't feel they should be married and this proposition mixes church and state instead of keeping it separate. I think it should be tossed all together.
You should probably wait on Texas and CA before you pop anything
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McCain's got Texas but no way in Cali. With Ohio in the bag, Obama can rock out with his cock out.
I'm sensing you voted yes on Prop 8? Heinous
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Massachusetts just approved decriminalization of weed. If you are over 18, you get it confiscated and pay a $150 civil fine. I knew my decision to apply to Harvard post Navy was sound.
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So Bone you are for mixing church and state? That is really what this law is about. It is poorly written proposition.
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Mainly I am not in favor of church influencing the policies of state. In the spirit of tolerance, I believe the government should only interefere with the church in so far as ensuring the church upholds the law.
I don't see any language in the proposition that is in conflict with my views. Having only read the ballot label, I may have missed some legalese, which I'd be happy to review if you can provide. Otherwise here it is:
ELIMINATES RIGHT OF SAME-SEX COUPLES TO MARRY. INITIATIVE CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT. Changes the California Constitution to eliminate the right of same-sex couples to marry in California. Provides that only marriage between a man and a woman is valid or recognized in California. Fiscal Impact: Over next few years, potential revenue loss, mainly sales taxes, totaling in the several tens of millions of dollars, to state and local governments. In the long run, likely little fiscal impact on state and local governments.
People who support this are either old, biggots, closet homos, or believe their space god thinks it's wrong. I don't fall into any of these categories so I have to say no to 8.
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I just deleted my last comment - I'm not sure, but I think I agree more with Bunky than I originally thought. I do think that she's mistaken about churches being forced to marry people against their will - this is a very typical religious right talking point - I've never seen credible evidence for it - it's more like a scare tactic to win votes.
However, this proposiiton is poorly written, and is about church and state. It's written by a bunch of religious right looneys who want o deny gay people a basic civil right. Plain and simple. And Bunky is right: California has already spoken on this matter. The proposition should be voted down, hard.
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Just to be sure, Bunky: are you saying that voting no on Prop 8 is mixing church and state? If so, you are badly misinformed: it is exactly the opposite. Prop 8 would outlaw same sex marriage, entirely for religious reasons. If that isn't an unlawful mixing of church and state, then there is no such thing. How could anyone possibly claim otherwise???
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Prop 8 should not even be on the ballots because the State Supreme Court ruled the ban unconstitutional.
I am completely annoyed that yet again, this issue is on the ballot. This needs to be dealt with a federal level so we can move forward once and for all.
There have been numerous legal papers that have gone back and forth citing the potential legal ramifications of passing Prop 8.
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I think the fact Prop 8 is even on the ballot is mixing church and state and is wrong.
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Well, I agree with that. Cheers!
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Obama just won VA... unreal...
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First off, Fuck the Bone. I am none of things mentioned in your comment.
My husband and I talked about this proposition last week. I told him I did not think it should be on the ballot, and how am I suppose to vote on something I can't relate to. He said I should vote based I what I believe.
Well, I don't believe that I should be voting on this issue. First off, I am taking rights away from people. Second, marriage is the only way currently to protect property rights of same sex couples in the state. A furthermore, we are allowing religion into government and I don't agree with that.
Yes I believe in God. But I also believe, as stated in the bible, it is not my place to judge people. While homesexuality and sodomy is considered a sin, so are many other activities that people participate in everyday. So if we are going to judge everyone else, we all need to start with ourselves first.
The law is vague and poorly written. While some of you may not agree, I would rather not vote on an issue that I am not informed enough on, and that there is not enough information about, than cast a vote a regret it later once the facts come out.
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Fair enough, Bunky. I personally think it's clear that the proposition is discriminatory, but as long as you're not voting for it, I won't fault you too much.
See you on Gears 2 this weekend (I'm sure).
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Yeah, I will probably be on
I am contemplating boycotting Zilla and getting the maps down first so he doesn't get the false impression that he is somehow sweeter than the rest of us...
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Obama's been elected. To quote Snoop, "I've got a Roli on my arm and I'm drinking chandon!"
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Woooooooooooooooooo hoooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!
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All I have to say is "fuck that lady" in the video who said she couldn't imagine "President O-bam-a". I hope you're crying now, you awful bitch.
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Bush is out! Palin's going back to Mooseland. Bigots and Rednecks from the south are mad. Gay haters from California are disgruntled. I choked out a monster today in jiu jitsu. Today was a good day. I'm going to bed a happy mofo.
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She'll be back in 2012, I have a feeling. But I agree... I'll be hitting the hay after I hear Obama's acceptance speech. What an amazing day this is.
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Couldn't g to sleep before the acceptance speech. He rocked it JFK style with a touch of Winston Churchill. Ninja has oratory skills.
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Oratory skills indeed.
Couldn't be more pleased.
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Amen.
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From an historical perspective, this says a lot about the magnitude of the event.
(In my mind, however, I am thinking, "Wow, look at all the white dudes.")
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Holy Shit!! Look at the comments flying on this board at townhall.com
What a bunch of reactionist, racist MF's
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These are a couple of my favorites. Do people really think this shit?
Reply # 86
Date: Nov 5, 2008 - 12:32 AM EST
Breaking News
Just in from the news wire:
President Barack Hussein Obama will name Osama Bin Laden Secretary of Defense.
Reply # 113
Date: Nov 5, 2008 - 1:02 AM EST
Subject: Dray
You're right Dray, AMERICANS didn't want McCain,but then ofcourse it wasn't the AMERICAN VOTES that decided the presidency.
LET's ALL QUIT OUR JOBS AND GO ON WELFARE!!!
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That's nothing: check out this forum thread from that right-wing site I used to troll.
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Reply # 86
Date: Nov 5, 2008 - 12:32 AM EST
Breaking News
Just in from the news wire:
President Barack Hussein Obama will name Osama Bin Laden Secretary of Defense.
He's done a remarkable job defending himself from the United States. :)
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Ross said:
That's nothing: check out this forum thread from that right-wing site I used to troll.
Wow. Reading that crap just ruined my day. Well, not really.
What a bunch of stupid, ignorant assholes.
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If the stupid, ignorant assholes aren't happy we must be doing something right! :)
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What cracks me up about those lunatics is that they believe that God is against Obama, that he's somehow forsaken them for making our government too secular. Well, what happened in the last two elections? They elected who they were sure God wanted, and the guy worked tirelessly to break down the barriers between church and state. And look where we are now - our country is in shambles (not necessarily because of that, of course). It doesn't even occur to them to consider that their God might actually want Obama to be president (it goes without saying that it doesn't occur to them that there is no god).
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Wow, that Micheal Sommerfeld character from your far right fundamentalist wacko forum seems like a pleasant fellow.
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Prop 8 has not been officially called, but it looks as if it passed. Now we will spend millions more in tax dollars fighting legal challenges of the law that will probably be filed immediately once it is officially announced it passed.
What a waste of time and tax payer money.
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I'm actually quite surprised that prop 1 and 2 passed here in Michigan.
A couple conservative co-workers of mine have been making comments about legalized marijuana. I tried to remind them that it was for medical-use only but they seemed to have selective hearing.
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Dude, weed should be decriminalized big time. I mean come on. Compared to the health risks of tobacco, booze, and junk food, weed is child's play.
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Yeah, the looneys on that site not only believe that Obama is a Muslim, but that he will want to be sworn in on a Koran! You can't make this stuff up, folks! What a bunch of tards!
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I can only take so much of that forum. The people on there are some very scary zealots. It's for people like these that you have events in history like the Inquisition, the Crusades, the bombing of the World Trade Center.
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Well I discovered today that I work with some racist MFers. I heard guys talking about how Obama better "know his place." I already knew I was in the minority in the office with the way I was voting, but wow. Oh well, at least the bigotry didn't affect the outcome of the election.
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Radmobile said:
I heard guys talking about how Obama better "know his place."
Yeah - Its PRESIDENT, ruler of the free world, BEEYOTCH! I got to catch up on all the news, but peeps are all happy over here. The world loves 'not-Bush'.
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Just watched the speeches. I must say, McCain's speech was exceptionally classy. If he ran his campaign like his concession speech, he would have had my vote.
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I agree, Fatty. I thought the same thing.
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Where's Bunky? I guess we can assume she didn't get drunk on champaigne at some wild Republican party last night...
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Here I am bitches! I am on the road this week and have been in the mountains today with limited reception on my iPhone.
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Here's a blog entry from a crazy right-wing religious guy I know. He spouts forth with almost every republican fear mongering talking point, like he's reading right from their playbook. Just one more type of delusional person that is out there with a vote.
I just can't see how people can view Obama's election as a sign of things getting worse. Sure, things could get worse under him, but if they do, you can be damn sure they would have been much worse if GWB was still in charge, and I don't hear him lamenting the fact that Bush has driven our country into the ground over the last 8 years.
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On the topic of Fox:
The Roche's were over for election night and for fun at one point we switched it over to the Fox News team (the guy on the left of the video above was anchoring). We couldn't believe how dumb the anchor and panal were. Also - Where as the other stations showed the celebrations of Obama's win and the speeches by McCain and Obama (which we all thought were great) - Fox ended their newscast with the anchor telling about the hundreds of e-mails he's received from people that are afraid of Obama. Their closing thought was about people's fear for the country. Cut to a Family Guy re-run...
Really?
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But look at how bad things had to get before people voted for something else. I don't know that Obama has all the answers, but if he just doesn't fuck anything else up, I'll be happy. He says he's not going to raise taxes for most of us, and I hope that's true. But if that's your biggest fear of this president (biggest rational fear), what's the big deal? Bush didn't raise government taxes, but he sure as hell caused everything else to be more expensive. It was a private-sector tax-hike. So he gave all the money to Big Oil, then spent more money than he had on a pointless war with shifting motives and goals... Christ, I think we'd have been better with Corky from Life Goes On...
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Ross said:
Here's a blog entry from a crazy right-wing religious guy I know...
I know I'm behind on this, but I just got around to reading the post. My favorite point in support of his argument is:
God’s Kingdom and economy almost always function in direct reverse of the world’s economy.
It's the only thing I agree with! More money given to "god's kingdom" (i.e. religious leaders, since god's kingdom doesn't exist on earth, arguably) means less money for important things.
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Well, that, and the fact that nobody turns to god when everything is going their way: it takes your life getting into the shitter for you to bother with something like church...
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I don't know, you're right that nobody turns to god when everything is going their way, but I think that excludes people who were brought up that way. There are lots and lots of people who are self-described evangelicals and have been that way all their lives.
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Absolutely. But the original post was about people turning to god. I think he's right in that if things in the country get worse, it will turn more people toward religion. It's just sad that he can't seem to understand that it's an emotion reaction, not a reasonable one.
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While I agree with what his key points are, he is far too emotional during his commentary. That is the problem with Prop 8, and why it should never have been on the ballot.
This is a proposition that has been campaigned based on personal and religious beliefs. Both sides are acting out on emotion, rather than using the rational thinking and looking at it as a human rights issue.
People are picking up and down the state, and it is chaos by the state capitol.
The issue is more than just about marriage. It is about all the legal rights and responsibilities that come with it.
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It seems simple to me. Vote yes on Prop 8 and gays can't marry. Vote no and they can. What am I missing?
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We (CA) voted on to ban gay marriage in 2000. The State Supreme court ruled the ban unconstitutional and here we are again.
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I agree with you that the whole thing is silly but Prop 8 still got on your ballot so you were forced to make a choice. Support, vote it down, or ignore it. So personally I would vote it down. I don't understand your position to either ignore it or support it.
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I choose not to vote on the Proposition out of personal principal. In hindsight, I probably should have voted no, instead of doing nothing.
My choice to not vote on it was out of pure irritation. I was 99% sure it was going to pass, and we would spend years fighting it in court and wasting tax payer dollars only for the State Supreme court to rule it unconstutional as they did when a similar ballot measure was passed in 2000. The ban on Gay Marriage was just lifted and it should have not been on the ballot to begin with.
I guess what you are really asking is if I oppose gay marriage. No I don't. When you get all of the emotional bullshit out of this arguement, here's what it comes down to in my opinion:
If same sex couples are not allowed to enter into marriage, they aren't legally entitled to the same rights as other couples who are allowed to do so. This comes down to matters involving property, advance directives, tax incentives, estate issues, etc.
Regardless of how the opponents of gay marriage feel, it is wrong to deprive these tax paying citizens of what I feel is a violation of their personal rights.
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So how can a State put illegal measures to a vote? Can they vote that rape is OK? The State Supreme Court clearly ruled on this matter. Voting allow a majority class to take away the rights of a minoirty. That's why the court had to rule.
Why was not blocked from the ballot? Bunky - I blame you and your voter apathy.
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I believe that this proposition was to define marriage for state constitution purposes and was an amendent.
Fatty I didn't vote due to apathy, in fact quite the opposite. It was because I was so pissed this was back on the ballot, packaged slightly different and was the most expensive proposition in our state's history. I knew it would pass, activist would sue, and it would cost the tax payers millions of dollars only to eventually have it overruled. It was such a waste of money.
I am a woman of principal, for better or worst.
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That's like being pissed that your dog shit on your carpet but not cleaning it up out of spite.
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HA HA HA!
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Whatever Dick.
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The ugly names again? How classy.
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Yeah, I guess it is not as sweet as sending a photo of yourself laying on a bed in what appears to be a seedy hotel room.... That's real class for you. I'll try to work on my skank factor so I can impress you some Bone Style Class...
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That's the spirit. Much better thought out and delivered than grade school name calling.
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Bone. You must have a lot of Echos.
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Yes and Bunky's one of them. Can't you feel the sexual tension already?
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Make sure not to look into any reflective surfaces.
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Bunky said:
Yeah, I guess it is not as sweet as sending a photo of yourself laying on a bed in what appears to be a seedy hotel room....
I don't think we're looking at the same picture. Was there a hotel room in that picture? I looked again and didn't see it...
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BigFatty said:
So how can a State put illegal measures to a vote? Can they vote that rape is OK? The State Supreme Court clearly ruled on this matter. Voting allow a majority class to take away the rights of a minoirty. That's why the court had to rule.
I think you have it a bit backwards, Fatty. It's a subtle point, but an important one: the court only interprets the current version of the law. They don't determine what objectively is illegal or not - or more to the point, they do, but only in the context of the current laws on the books. It's up to legislators (or in dipshit California's case, a referendum) to determine what those laws are. That is what dictates what is illegal or not, not what judges say.
So in theory, yes, the populace could vote on a referendum to make rape legal. In practice, it'd be tough to get on the ballot, though.
I think the confusion is that you appear to believe that there is such a thing as an objectively "illegal measure" - there isn't. Laws are subjective and man-made, and judges can only rule on legality based on existing laws. Putting the marriage amendment on the ballot essentially changes the laws, so the judges would now have to rule based on the new laws.
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I can't believe that an issue that affects, what, 3%-4% of the population is getting this much attention. Some estimates say as many as 10% of general population is gay, but I gotta think not all of them want to get married, just like lots of straight people don't get married.
What kills me is the argument that gay-marriage opponents make; "If we let two dudes marry, then what happens when a guy wants to marry a goat?" Wait, what?
And sorry Bunky, but I have about as much patience for 'principles' voters as I do for 'values' voters. Mother Theresa had principles and values. So did Hitler. So does George Bush. All that proves is that people have the capacity to believe very strongly in their ideas, even when they're wrong. Not that I'm saying you're right or wrong. Just that, from my perspective, you can't use principles or values to defend your actions. If you can't back up your position with an explanation, you either don't know enough about the issue, or enough about your own position.
That last paragraph sounded a lot more confrontational than I intended. It's not really directed at you, Bunky. You just got me on the topic. :) I don't want to log into Gears and hear you saying 'F- the Robot'... :)
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Looks like California all the fun election ads. I just stumbled across this. Late but fun.
Have you seen this before Bunky?
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President Barack Hussein Obama will name Osama Bin Laden Secretary of Defense.